Posted by: Bill | September 2, 2007

Please Pray for the Church in Santiago, Chile

Our sister church in Santiago, Chile, has come through a very difficult two weeks. I have a very good friend who is there as a missionary, John Hoyt, who let us know about the division of the church and asked us to pray.

Here I am posting a message Martin Bentley sent out last week:

Thank God and thank you for your prayers. Our trip to Chile last week was much better than we might have expected.

On Wednesday night the 8th of August, Raul Moreno called the church in Santiago to follow him in joining Kip McKean’s movement. Raul told the 280 disciples that the Florida churches were not on track to save the world, and that if they wanted to fulfill the great commission, they needed to join Kip. There were some heated exchanges at the building, following his announcement (apologies were made later). Hector Munoz, the administrator, boldly stood up and read a scripture in Revelation, and told the church that the Bible calls for repentance rather than division. On Friday the 10th John and Sylvia Reus, Terry Folker, Carmen and I traveled to Santiago in an attempt to restore unity. Upon our arrival Saturday morning, we met with the Hoyts, the Escobars from Vina del Mar, the Amestoys from Concepcion and the Munozes, who had already met with many of the disciples and had also composed a statement of convictions, similar to the “Unity Document.” Then, Carmen and I met with Raul and Lynda (who is very saddened by this situation) Moreno. At this point, Raul told me that he had initiated a call to Kip around July 1 to discuss this division. Raul also indicated that Kip’s church would pay his salary, from now on. Carmen and I met two more times with Raul and Lynda in our desire to help them. At 2:00 p.m. we met with the entire congregation for about five hours to study out God’s plan for unity and judgement in the church, noting that there should be “no divisions among you” from l Cor. 1:10. There was an orderly time for questions and answers. During this time, Raul apologized for some of his actions on the previous Wednesday night, but he did not repent of his divisiveness. Instead, he stated that “Not all division is bad,” citing the fact that Israel and Judah had divided in l Kings 12. (In a congregational meeting on the following day, we noted that the cross of Jesus had united “All Israel” in Acts 2:36.) On Sunday the Morenos met with a group of about 30 in their apartment building, while the rest of us (about 250) had a great worship in the regular facility. John Hoyt gave a meaningful communion service, his first in Spanish, and John Reus preached an inspiring sermon. We met, again, at 4:00 with the church and at 6:00 with the Bible talk leaders. At this time, both Raul Moreno and Kip McKean were marked for their divisiveness (Romans 16:17 and Titus 3:10). On Monday morning we had an inspiring congregational devotional and prayer time. Between, before and after these meetings the staff in Chile (unfortunately minus Raul and Lynda) and the group from Florida met to study, pray and organize. Late Monday afternoon, the eight staff members from Chile and the five disciples from Florida had decided that they believed that God’s will was for the lead couples from Concepcion and Vina del Mar to return to lead the Santiago church along with the Hoyts and the Munozes. These four couples will lead the church as a group, with the Cristian and Luz Amestoy actually serving as the lead couple. Monday evening John, Sylvia, Terry and Carmen returned to Florida. I remained until Thursday night. From Tuesday morning until Thursday evening we met to pray, study and decide about leadership for the mission churches in Chile and to plan the Wednesday devotional, the rest of the week and to begin planning for the immediate future. The Wednesday night devotional was a high point of the week as Cristian, Luz and the rest of the leaders were presented as the new leadership for the church. Near the end of the devotional, Alicia, the mother of one of the disciples, was baptized into Christ. Just prior to her rebirth, Alicia said,”I never thought that I would have the privilege of knowing Jesus and understanding his word.” Her words helped me to realize how privileged I am. In that same devotional, it was necessary for us to mark Alfredo and Alejandra Anuch, Raul’s right hand couple, for their divisiveness. It feels contradictory to mark church members, because we try so hard to keep them saved. But, we understand that the scriptures leave us no alternative, in order that the larger flock might be protected. The 250 disciples who remain in the original church have high standards of unity, love, faithfulness and devotion. This church has a great desire to reach Chile and beyond with the gospel. They are an example and an inspiration to us all. We thank God for His strength and for His word. Thanks, also, to John, Sylvia and Terry for their expert, faithful and loving help. Please, pray for the churches in Santiago, Concepcion and Vina del Mar and their newly organized leadership. Please, pray also, for the repentance and the reunion of the thirty who left with Raul. Thanks, and God bless.

Hear Martin’s Sunday Sermon in Orlando about the division and Good News from the Southern Cone (South America). 

For a biblical outlook on church splitting tactics you can read (In Spanish) my article about the church split in San Pedro Sula Honduras.

Kelcy Hahn also posted…

SANTIAGO WASN’T THE ONLY CHURCH on the receiving end of such tactics. A member of our tiny congregation in Curacao (an island near Venezuela) writes:
On April 15, 2007 Micheal Hart (who was not leading the church by then) in the
Sunday service at the end of his preaching announced that he had decided that he
is going to lead the church in Curacao and that the church is going to be affiliated
to [sic] the Portland International Church. He also mentioned that those who does [sic]
not agree, to not bother to come on Wednesday.
(Those who) didn’t agree with the announcement and the way this was presented…are
meeting at my house on Wednesdays and Sundays….
Please pray for us since we are in need for some help (leaders) in Curacao.

Our smallest churches are vulnerable. We can help them.


Responses

  1. Mirza, me dirijo a ti especialmente. Tengo lágrimas en mis ojos porque a pesar de que no conocía a mi hermano Exequiel, es una tristeza muy grande saber que la maldad de este mundo nos puede quitar lo que más amamos.

    También soy esposa y no me imagino vivir una situación así. No tengo palabras suficientes para decirte lo impotente que me siento y cuanta empatía siento por ti. Cuida mucho tu corazón y que Dios te fortalezca en estos tiempos de sufrimiento.

    Te amo en Cristo …

    Carlet
    Iglesia de Cristo en México

  2. This is ridiculous. What Raul did was to stand up for what was right, and the description that is here on this page is deceptive and manipulative. Me must first be loyal to GOD and only then can we be truly united. See the results of the Honduras church to see if God is not with what is happening: from 50 to 75 sold-out disciples in one year, and with close to 500 in attendance for the first year anniversary service, and over one hundred visitors who want to study the Bible! And this is with a staff couple who works in secular jobs full-time in order to pay their own salary!

    God wants us to be fiery hot as disciples and not slip back into worldly mindsets, as has happened in every church that I know of, except the ones who have stepped out to be led by Kip McKean.

    Jesus calls each and every person who wants to follow him to give up everything, and put his kingdom and righteousness first, even before our own family! And our own lives! Those who reject this message will reject anyone who preaches it. Those who accept it will become truly united, as Jesus calls us to be.

    Unity comes from truly putting God first in the daily practice of our lives. Oil and water will separate, but drops of oil in water will all come together. Today I see clearly how God is again calling together all sold-out disciples into one unified body of believers.

    I am not ashamed of this! This is incredibly exciting! And I am amazingly blessed to be able to be part of it.

    You can kill the messenger, through character assassination or a bullet in the brain, but Jesus’ message will live through the centuries!

    People have been spreading misinformation and outright lies throughout the ICOC for years now about Kip and what is going on. What they were saying did not seem to add up to me so I moved up to be a part of his church and find out first hand. And this was the single best decision I have ever made in my life, after the initial decision to become a disciple twelve years ago! My life has grown and changed tremendously in the last two years and I know without a shadow of a doubt that the only hope for this world and to fix the problems in the church is coming from the very man who God used to start the ICOC in the first place!

    Does no-one remember that the ICOC of today has totally gone back on its core convictions that it was founded on so few years ago? Did you not make Jesus Lord of your life no matter what anyone else did right or wrong? Must you now try to twist things around to try to make yourself look like you are doing OK when you know full well in your heart that it is a tremendous lie?

    God will call each of us to give an account for what we have done! And today is a day to stand up and do something! If you are leading a lukewarm church, recognize this and decide to do whatever it takes to change it, even if it means that you and your family will be out on the street for a time! If you are a member of a lukewarm church, be realistic and realize that even a hot coal in a cold stone pit will eventually go out. If you are a burning ember, the best way to get a big fire going is unite yourself with others who are just as hot or hotter and together you will make a huge conflagration! But if you stay where you are, thinking that you can “help” or make things better, realize that things will not get better until your leader clearly demonstrates with his actions that he is willing to do whatever it takes. I commend Raul Moreno for doing just that. He caved for a time under pressure from other leaders, but could not take it any longer, knowing that his church was not the way Jesus wanted it to be. Read his story to get a much more complete view of what happened: http://www.upsidedown21.org/1.1/index.php?langID=1&artID=206

    Raul and those who took the stand with him do NOT need to repent for standing up for Jesus’ mission to evangelize the world. They need to be commended and imitated by God-fearing men and women all around the world! Please pray for God to raise up more leaders and to send them out to the harvest field (Luke 10:2-3) and rejoice when men say all kinds of evil against you because of Jesus (Matthew 5:11) because your reward is not on this earth but awaiting you in Heaven!

    Carlos

  3. Carlos,

    I found three things problematic with your comments:

    1) You ask: “Must you now try to twist things around to try to make yourself look like you are doing OK when you know full well in your heart that it is a tremendous lie?”

    Do you really believe that Bill is not a “sold-out” disciple? Do you even know his life? You and others in your group are unbelievably quick to judge people, usually without even knowing the facts.

    2) You ask: “Does no-one remember that the ICOC of today has totally gone back on its core convictions that it was founded on so few years ago?”

    First of all, Jesus’ church was not founded “so few years ago.” Contrary to what he or anyone else thinks, Kip did not found God’s church or come up with the plan of salvation or the method of spreading the gospel.

    Secondly, most of the people in the ICC have not gone back on their core convictions. We still believe the same things today that we did when we were baptized. That has not changed.

    3) You state: “See the results of the Honduras church to see if God is not with what is happening: from 50 to 75 sold-out disciples in one year, and with close to 500 in attendance for the first year anniversary service, and over one hundred visitors who want to study the Bible!”

    Numbers and growth alone do not prove God’s approval. Two of the fastest-growing “christian” groups in the world are the Mormons and the Jehovah’s Witnesses. Do these groups have God’s approval? There are many ways to grow a church, but not all of them are within God’s will.

    Carlos, if the group that you are a part of is so great, don’t you think people will figure that out without all of the denigration of the ICC? How come you guys can’t talk about the great things going on in your churches without simultaneously insulting everyone else?

  4. 1. I don’t believe anyone is saying Bill is not a Disciple. I myself knew something was not right in the ministry I personally was in but I kept fighting it!! I felt the Spirit left and I needed to be with a church that was mimicking what I read biblically. …and, to clarify, I did not leave half way accross the country to follow Kip McKean, I went where I felt and saw the Spirit active and living!

    2. I don’t believe anyone is saying that Kip McKean started the church. I do believe the Spirit led the man to assist in leading a movement. The man is not Jesus nor will he ever be close. He sins every day if not like most of us even more. I follow his vision and his God, not him! You and others may believe the samething you did in the past; however, in MY personal experience, many have stopped living what they believed. They became readers of how to be a fishermen and the gear is still in the Garage. Again, in My experience in the church I was a part of. Yours may be awesome, and I encourage you to continue to continue spreading the aroma of Christ and win over as many as possible to follow Him, not you or your leader.

    3. I don’t believe that numbers mean much. However, they do mean a lot when nobody is following the “GO, MAKE DISCIPLES” portion of Matthew 28 and they only go by “teaching them to obey everything…” It’s all a part of the same scripture.

    *I completely agree with what Carlos said above. If you are angry about what you read, you may be reading it with a tainted heart. I believe many get upset and stirred up because some of what they read has some merit and their hearts don’t know how to process it or don’t like it. For example Mike Taliferro’s response to Raul.

    Again, in the past, has Kip sinned…yes, Arrogance, Pride…Abolutely. Me too. And we will continue to sin. Not because we are all mean ugly worldy people, it’s because we all have a sinful nature.

    So, Raul, Bravo to you and your family for standing up and not quenching the Spirit. The Spirit moved you, you listened, and you acted.


Leave a comment

Categories